The following is commentary. You’re not obligated to read it. There are other blogs out there…
It was another pleasant and awesome day ripping groomers at Alpine Meadows. Once you found your personal line, it was possible that you could not only set the first tracks, but also the second, third and fourth tracks. It was a similar experience last Thursday, except that it was an amazing powder day. Just. Sublime.
Pick any day in between though and it was a far different story.
Fortunately, Alpine Meadows was blessed by the fact that coverage on the mountain was far better than it has been at any time over the past few years, allowing crowds to spread out and keeping smiles on people’s faces. But it wasn’t all grins last weekend. There was a fair share of commentary on various social media sites about long lift lines, long food lines, long shuttle times, lack of parking and traffic on Highway 89. This picture, taken somewhere along the road on the Sherwood side summed up many people’s feelings.
You really can’t just say that it was just because of the holiday weekend, because the weekend before that, there were similar traffic jams, lift lines and parking issues. The “KCRA effect” is already there with another storm cycle in place for the upcoming weekend as well. We expect more of the same will be happening by Friday morning.
The Friends of Squaw Valley group called attention to the issue with this picture posted last week. Squaw Valley and KSL Capital received entitlements to build nearly 1500 more bed spaces, an indoor waterpark, countless square feet of new commercial construction and more over a 25 year period. While the EIR estimated that travel times would increase only a minute or two due to the increase development, it’s clear that is not going to be the case. The addition of the proposed gondola, the multiple new housing projects in the planning stages around Alpine Meadows and Olympic Valley will only continue to ensure that more crowds will be here, more often.
It’s not just the proposed development. Several different sources have reported that SquAlpine sold about 30% more season passes this year than last year. It shows.
Do we really want to be in a place where there are crushing crowds every weekend, during every season throughout the year? Let’s remember that although the current new snowfall makes everyone giddy with delight, we have to remember to protect what we love…from being over-loved.
https://youtu.be/HsycXV-R__E
Great commercial – too funny to see Alex. Kind of like a Reagan flashback in the Trump era.
No waiting at Squaw, ’cause you can’t get there. LOL. My friends left Serene Lakes at 7:30am on Saturday and turned around at 80/89 intersection which was gridlocked. They were working on a plan for “other activities” – no skiing 🙁
So is it just Squaw/Alpine that is slammed? Is Sugar Bowl as bad? How about Northstar?
Everyone one was slammed last weekend. Sugar and Northstar are less consistently jammed.
Mark,
With respect, and not to disagree with your premise about squaw Alpine, which I agree with, but Sugar Bowl was not slammed last weekend. 5 min lines max on Disney and Lincoln. Ski on Ski off Crows Peak. Summit had a long line at opening since it hasn’t been open. This was my experience on Saturday and Sunday from 8:30 to 12:30. This experience was a throw back to the days I used to love skiing at squaw before KSL turned it into a shit show and destroyed the ski experience.
Thanks for your correction. Would it be safe to say just the road to Sugar Bowl was slammed in the morning?
That was the odd thing. Highway 40 from truckee was closed so we only had the road from 80. Much after 8:15 it started to get fairly heavy and eventually parking was a problem. Lift lines however were surprisingly great. Heck a couple times on Lincoln we went single and waited about a minute. Traffic out at end of day was a bitch too.
Its that parking limitation that makes Sugar Bowl a good place. Alpine used to be like that until the shared Squaw ticket and shuttles started…
Shhhhhhhhhh!!!
Wow! Mammoth is doing the same thing in my little shit town of Big Bear Lake corporate greed at its best. They sold almost 32,000 tickets for saturday and sunday. Total grid lock I just stay home on the weekends it sucks.
When did running a ski area turn into a competition? That in itself shows the egotism of ksl (and others, as well). Is it really not satisfying enough to have your parking lots (as well as every other available bit of space) filled and gridlocked?
Here’s an idea. Let’s invite our county “leaders” to come on up for a day of skiing one fine Saturday. And maybe have them join us for a Saturday at the lake in July. Seriously, they need to experience it first hand.
I bet our county ” leaders” do not ski
True, and most probably couldn’t find Squaw or Martis Valley West without a GPS (maybe not even with one). Hell, just tell them someone dropped a quarter in the parking lot, I’m sure that would get them here in a hurry. I just want them to experience the junk show for a day.
LOL about the quarter!!! Thanks for the laugh!!!
Capitalism’d
Vote with your wallet, buy a BC set up.
Boycott corporate ski areas.
What other options are there really????
That’s a serious question.
Don’t ski Fri or Sat. Those are gaper days. They pay full retail. Nuff said. Andy can make his money on Fri and Sat. Plus when raging waters gets built, that’ll take about 30% of people who shouldn’t really be on the hill off the hill.
Unfortunately you still have to deal with the traffic all over the place even if you are not riding at the resorts. The water park fools will also be clogging up the roads even though they won’t be stacking up the lift lines. I kept thinking I was going to get clobbered by a tree while stopped on 89 as I was trying to get home from work. I think another person is going to get killed before this season is over.
already happened
http://mynews4.com/news/local/deadly-crash-reported-just-north-of-squaw-valley-caltrans
Is it just me or does it seem to others that KSL is skimping on staff? There have been days (Jan 4) when the parking lot wasn’t even cleared. And since when is the Funi put on wind hold when Summit is able to run (Jan 3)? As long as KSL stays involved I’ll be taking my $$$ elsewhere. It is clear that these folks just don’t get it!
Haha, I remember the SV deal back then.
I believe it was a 30 minute “average wait” of ALL lift lines..
If I remember correctly?
I was thinking it was 20 minutes. Gotta love the Cushings…they tried!
This is the best website on planet earth. Mark knows what’s up. I thought all the anti-KSL rhetoric was just exaggeration but now I’m a believer.
Mark–don’t worry about the crowds. Once the lawsuits are over and KSL starts selling development rights, builds the gondola, and doesn’t need the cash from cheap passes they will jack up the price of passes and tickets (except for free passes for those who pay millions for tiny condos in the village) to create an “exclusive” skiing experience and the crowds will be gone. Fits right in with their deal with Wheels Up–45 min private flights from San Jose.
My best days/years at Squaw were when I paid over $1000 for passes in the 90’s and into the early 2000’s. Uncrowded, pow for the better part of the day as the mountain opened. I will be back if the price goes back up (seems backward, I know). Miss the mountain, don’t miss the crowd.
Sadly, it’s a different world
You guys love to complain…for the record the Soda Springs off ramp was backed up a mile or more onto Hwy 80 at 7:30am on Friday as I drove by on the way to work. I am sure the road was still a mess. On Saturday my friends in Serene Lakes said it was an hour to SB and parking was non-existent. They wish they never left the house. The lines were a mess all day…..”worst traffic/line day ever” This is from 20 yr residents. Tell it like its….the economy is strong, the population is up, skiing is more popular than ever and the resorts are still operating in 1980 mode. Throw in 10ft of snow, MLK weekend and you get a perfect storm. Stop blaming KSL, 89 is a always a mess on a “powder weekend day”, ski on a weekday or suck it up.
Economy is strong √
The population is up √
Skiing is more popular than ever….check your facts….it’s quite the opposite.
Resorts are operating in 1980…mode…check your facts…no ultra cheap multi-mountain passes in 1980
Lastly the article does note the problem goes beyond KSL…and crowds have been every weekend…and they will be here again next weekend. The question is if it has always been bad, why do we need to make it worse?
Fair enough Mark skiing is not more popular overall, but in this booming, wealthy California economy I suspect it is more accessible financially than ever. Cheap passes don’t help the crowds but Sat and Sun were blackouts for silver and bronze and it was still packed. Also KSL didn’t invent the cheap passes it was Vail and the stable cash (even in bad years) let them spend money every year vs the old days when Cushing would not spend a dime. (but at least the lifts would be open)
When I say 80’s mode I mean the roads are the same, the parking lots are the same and the complaints are the same. I remember people complaining about 30+ min lift lines all the time when I was a kid. This is not a new phenomena. Locals complain about weekenders creating traffic and lines, weekenders complain about locals being…..local. Now we get pissed when we have to wait 10 min. Its a I want it now world, we are just living in it.
btw…thanks for the great articles and posts as someone who has skied Alpine, Squaw, SB, Boreal, Donner etc. for almost 40 years I appreciate your perspective as someone looking out for the mountain and the culture we have.
Rumor has it that internally Squaw/Alpine is empowering ALL employees to suspend passes from pass holders if the employee sees fit. Perhaps this is due to the overselling of passes and their attempt to thin the herd. Unfortunately, Squaw is no longer the resort many of us grew up with. After 30+ years of skiing Squaw and hucking my meat off it’s countless cliffs, I have made the decision to not buy a pass there again under KSL. While the terrain pulls at the heartstrings of my adolescence, standing in line for hours and the constant and repetitive excuses for not opening terrain has worn me down. Simply put, SQUAW DOESN’T CARE.
For those “local yokels”… that made the commitment to make Truckee/Tahoe their home… you should have known, back in the 80’s & 90’s,(when you had the opportunity to attend Planning meetings,or at least paying attention to the large developments that were given the “green light” in both Placer & Nevada County’s, that by 2010, over-crowding was going to change the lifestyle of “living in paradise”… When I could not longer go shopping for my family for lack of parking, and forced to sit on the floor of the upper-lodge at Squaw with my young family to eat our lunch… I thought: “Time to move”, and we did. I am a real believer that it is the small stresses in everyday living, that build up in our bodies, and cause real health problems. I wasn’t willing to be frustrated stuck in traffic, just trying to accomplish everyday errands necessary to keep a family going. Hearing all the stories and level of frustration and even anger over locals trying to get to work, or to the store, being gridlocked and taking a usual 5-10min. drive taking over 2 hr’s. , I am so glad to not call Truckee/Tahoe my home. I moved to Lake Tahoe in 1963, graduated from So. Tahoe High School, moved to Truckee in 1979 to raise a family (because So. Shore was already having traffic problems), and moved from Truckee in 2008. Sorry guys…. life in paradise has become a living hell due to poor planning…. can’t undo it.
Excellent. So where did you move to?
Mark- Very insightful post. The 30% is alarming, but not surprising given the huge crowds out there. Are you able to quantify this? 50k, 60k, 70k passholders for this season?
That information is not public so people can make best guesses based on what employees have leaked. Multiple people have suggested this years number is 40k compared to 30k in recent years. However that is all just conjecture that did not originate with me.
Oh its all speculative, however what is guaranteed is that KSL is attempting one of the largest cash grabs in the history of skiing in california. I’ve got a good source that says Mammoth is getting ready to buy Squaw/Alpine. I hope it gets done so Squaw can get back on track. Right now they are just ruining the Cushing/Squaw legacy and its a downright shame.
That Alex Cushing commercial brings it all back. I don’t want to apologize for KSL as they really need to figure out how to run a Tahoe ski resort and quit thinking they are going to have some groomer destination paradise for intermediates. But…
I very much recall what skiing was like in the 80s and 90’s at Squaw. Crowded with very long lift lines…but you could always get there and park. And back then I never got there early. These days parking/traffic is completely stupid but if you get on the mountain and most everything is running with plenty of snow (huge caveats), lines aren’t too bad and the skiing off-piste remains best in class.
Squaw needs to figure out how to run their operations. Big snow dumps are the normal in Tahoe. But the crowds are equally a factor of a super booming economy 186 miles down the freeway.
If day use numbers are actually up that must mean that more people are arriving per car or transit as the number of spaces for parking at Squaw is down since the village has been built. People staying in the new hotel rooms could account for some of this. It would be nice to know vehicle occupancy numbers. The parking space is the same at Alpine, It has not been increased in years. I believe the numbers at Alpine have stayed about the same. I am proud that we handled these crowds with a much smaller staff. Seems as though efficiency has drastically declined through miss management.
If I had the know how and the $$$ I’d start a new ski place. With this much interest there must be a crowd willing to go to a new place that offers more relaxed skiing.