Disclaimer: We’re going to talk about the Base To Base Gondola here, and not all of that talk will be positive. No matter what is said here, none of that is a reflection on those people that work to make Alpine Meadows a great place to be day in and day out. The fact that all of you work so hard to make this place so great is exactly what we are afraid of losing. Thanks for everything that you all do, from COO Ron Cohen, right on down to those part time seasonal workers that just make things work.
It doesn’t matter what we say or do now, the Base To Base Gondola (aka the California Express) linking Alpine Meadows and that yet to be named valley to the north is coming. Parts are already arriving, money sits somewhere in a vault to pay for it, and construction is slated to begin on May 1 (or sooner).
Some details about the gondola were copied and pasted from the Alterra press release this week by various ski blogs and news agencies. We hope to dig just a bit deeper with this post, and no, that does not mean that I’ll be joining the massive construction team this summer.
You have to understand, they are not building this monstrosity for us – meaning those of us that have been skiing Alpine Meadows for most of our lives. Sure, there’s a few of you out there that like to sneak over to the dark side and enjoy some Granite Chief laps. But Alterra is not investing an estimated $60 million on this project just so Jerry can bring the wife and kids over to Alpine Meadows for a run or two. Did we mention that the cost of the project has doubled since it was first proposed about 5 years ago? Yikes!
The Base To Base Gondola will make “Mystery Valley” Alpine Meadows the third largest resort in North America. Had KSL focused on the gondola project first, instead of the village expansion, they might have beat Vail Resorts to the punch. But, instead, Vail Resorts connected Park City and The Canyons to create the largest resort in the US first. If you’ve skied at either PCMR or The Canyons, you know they are also as different as Alpine Meadows and our neighbor to the north. That gondola was a similar waste of money…and the Peak To Peak at Whistler-Backcomb, same.
The marketing department continues to sell the idea that this is a long held vision for the people that built Squaw Valley and Alpine Meadows. At one point, that may have actually been true. But once Intrawest built the first village at Squaw Valley in the early 2000’s that changed everything. Many of us have chosen to ski at Alpine Meadows exclusively because it offers the same terrain without the glitz, glamour and inconvenience of the village experience.
Those of us that spend every day at either Alpine or Squaw, or even most weekends know the real problem. Both mountains are already operating at capacity for just about every weekend and holiday of the core season. Adding in the gondola, which accesses no new terrain, will not solve that problem. Nor will a very minimal traffic reduction on Highway 89.
The gondola is being built to sell condos, plain and simple. Who doesn’t want to own a condo in a faux alpine village in North America’s third largest resort? The funny thing is, with the current lack of real estate inventory in the Tahoe area, Alterra could probably build a whole bunch of simple condos, without adding a waterpark or a gondola, and still sell all of them in the first year. They would likely sell for twice the price that was in their original prospectus.
Fun Facts
- Alterra is hoping to complete this project during this summer/fall season and open it sometime early next season.
- The project includes 4 different major construction sites for the base stations and mid stations. At least 3 out of 4 of those sites will involve much more work that just installing a station.
- There’s a large number of towers that will need to be set over the course of 2.2 miles. Many of those towers are in areas where there are no roads.
- The amount of construction related truck traffic and helicopter traffic in the neighborhood of Olympic Valley and Alpine Meadows will be significant this summer.
- LiftBlog.com has the gondola listed as two separate lifts. The section from the village to the KT22 ridge would be one lift, which may operate on its own on high wind days. The section from Alpine to the KT would be the other lift, which has no reason to operate if this section is too windy. Obviously the gondola cars would transfer from one cable to the other at the KT mid-station.
- We’ve been asking questions and the best assumption is that the Alpine mid-station operates similar to the TLC mid-station, with two separate cables connected by a stacked bull wheel.
The Good Things
A lot of people fought the gondola for a variety of reasons. But one of the most important things was protecting the Granite Chief Wilderness, and the viewshed within the Alpine Meadows community. When the initial proposal was introduced, and it was just hideous, appropriate outrage from the community forced KSL/Alterra to explore additional alternatives. Ultimately, “Alternative 4” was approved by Placer County and the United States Forest Service. What does that mean?
- The route of the gondola was moved about as far away from the boundary of the Granite Chief Wilderness as possible.
- The gondola will be only minimally visible from the wilderness area
- The gondola will only be minimally visible from Alpine Meadows road
- Yellow legged frog habitat and other wetlands were protected
- The gondola route will no longer be directly over the Alpine Meadows Sun Deck. It will still go across the parking area and directly in front of the lodge.
The Bad Things
Moving the gondola to the “Alternative 4” location moved the Alpine Meadows mid-station (on the White Wolf property) from the top of an avalanche path to the bottom of an avalanche path. Avalanche mitigation will be a very big deal. It’s been well documented how Troy Caldwell has built everything with a lot of concrete at White Wolf to withstand potential avalanches. The same will be true for the mid-station. That is just one of many factors that have upped the cost of the project.
There’s going to be some significant alteration of the base area at Alpine Meadows. The base station on the Alpine Meadows side will be located just above the current ski school meeting area. The entire area in front of the Sun Deck will be filled to bring it just about level with the Roundhouse platform and the TLC platform. The idea is that you can walk off the deck and directly to the gondola, Roundhouse or TLC. Summit will still be an uphill jaunt.
That will close off the breezeway and it’s unclear exactly what the plan is there. The solution that makes the most sense would be to return the steps up through the middle of the deck, the way they used to be. I certainly hope they are not hoping to funnel everyone through the lodge. I also hope they are not expecting people to go around the lookers left side of the lodge where the small carpet currently sits.
It’s also going to be a little bit more inconvenient to go around the gondola to get to TLC, Meadow or the Big Carpet.
The biggest problem with the gondola, as it relates to Alpine Meadows, is the ability to outstrip the capacity of the mountain. We have said it many times, the parking capacity at Alpine Meadows is a good match for the current mountain capacity. On the really busy days, Alpine Meadows serves around 5,000 skiers and riders, along with some peripheral non-riders. The gondola has the capacity to bring an additional 1,400 people every hour. That could lead to some very quick overcrowding on our side of the mountain. Sure, there’s going to be some people going the other way too…but we know what will really happen.
The gondola also facilitates the expansion of the village at Nameless Village, which is also a bad thing. If it encourages the building of water parks and rollercoasters…well I hope people are still willing to keep speaking up for Tahoe, and what is left of the natural beauty. I am also concerned that eventually, Alterra will make some land swap deals with the USFS that will privatize some of the land at Alpine Meadows, allowing for additional development on this side of the gondola.
How will people use the gondola? We’ve got some ideas:
- A one way ride on the gondola will be 16 minutes. If you can swing a roundtrip, the 8 passenger cabin is perfect for that family picnic lunch. You’ll be protected from the weather and have some nice scenic views along the way. Nobody will be hovering over your table asking if you’re leaving soon. If you have to get off in Squaw Valley, use the opportunity to use the restroom and pick up a cookie at Wild Flour for dessert on the return trip.
- The gondola cabin will also provide a beautiful protected and scenic environment for that next Zoom call. Since nobody works in an office anymore, take a gondola ride and make it your temporary office. You won’t even need to use a fake Zoom background!
- Squirrel Murphy…if you know what I mean.
- I’ve already heard dozens of people refer to it as the “Ganjola”. Whether or not there will be a “hotbox” enforcement team or not has not been announced. Then again, that’s not really my thing…
- Alterra will be missing the boat if they don’t recognize the VRBO potential for each of those empty gondola cabins after the lifts close for the day. Or maybe just make it creative employee housing after hours, there’s always a shortage.
There’s got to be better uses for $60 million
There’s some obvious needs that might improve the skiing and riding experience at SVAM for everyone. At Alpine Meadows, replacing the Scott Chair and Lakeview Chair come to mind. Over the hill, Red Dog and Granite Chief are just two chairs that are really ready for replacement.
In looking at the overall improvements Alterra scheduled for 2021, two new six packs were eliminated at Mammoth after promising them in 2020. This list goes on and on.
What Alterra really needs is a third resort in the Northern Sierra to accommodate the large numbers of day-trip capable Ikon pass holders, which outstrip the capacity of Squaw Valley and Alpine Meadows. Instead we’re going to get a gondola that we don’t really need.
That said, I don’t own either mountain. I’m not a partner or investor in Alterra either. It’s just not my choice. Always expect change. I had better start planning the menu for my first picnic ride.
Let’s see what happens. Thanks for laying this out, Mark. Always appreciate reading your thoughts.
Squirrel Murphy….Hot Diggity Dog, let’s go have some fun, Gus….
I hope to be the first one to Squirrel Murphy this thing! It’s good to have ambitions.
The question is how much time you have between the mid stations! 😉
As long as it’s 2 minutes between stationsI’ll be fine. They don’t call me the minuteman for nothing! 😜
Well written. Thank you for the good, bad and ugly details of the Gondola.
Thanks for the good description. It is going to be faster to get to Alpine from NoName, than any other place, including up the road to park. Slope congestion will be real. Sad. Maybe Altruma will invest in a few more patrol to help do traffic calming, which Alpine often needs as crazed skiers who can ski from top of Palisades down the White River of Death (Mtn run) with no turns, try the same at Alpine. Alpine has longer real runs, but plenty of crossings. Occasionally its very dangerous with skiers who are on 150 cm fatties just doing turn less laps. Grump, grump, grump
Amen, brother. You cautiously danced around the intangible concern that the Squallywood attitude will infect Alpine Meadows–something that thus far has been minor IMHO. I had a great example last week of it happening, but I will spare the guilty employee who was on loan from Squallywood. Overall it’s rare, but more BSD’s coming over for 4 or 5 hops on Summit won’t help the AM vibe.
You forgot to mention the pow day KT lineup is now in our valley too.
I’ll be happy to not have to put rubber to road to get a couple Squaw laps in. I live in Alpine and I almost never go to Squaw because it’s just too much of a hassle to drive all the way down AM then all the way up SV.
I think people who want to ski Squaw for its famous factor will still ski Squaw—because that’s what they came for. Maybe they’ll come over to Alpine for a few laps sometimes but that’s not much different than what happens now, when out of towners make one day of their trip an Alpine day.
I’m glad no new lift-serviced terrain was added. Keeps Beaver and Estelle for those who really want it and are willing to hike for it.
Well written on spot on point. I know I’m a little edgy and we don’t agree on some things but this? You nailed. I was in complete support of this KST original movement and look how that turned out for me? Probably the best thing that ever happened to me in retrospect. However, i feel for all of you there.. The machine keeps turning and it’s sad for everything about Tahoe. It makes me sad to see this actually happening. Keep the stoke alive and do the best you can! When you have had enough of this madness, hit me up and I can show you some crown jewels up north!
Thanks for all this info. My biggest concern on how this gondola will be used was mentioned by the previous poster. I envision most of the Squaw-bound traffic from Tahoe City will now try to park at Alpine and take the gondola straight to the top of KT. It sure would beat spending up to an hour in traffic slogging along 89 from Alpine to The Squaw lot. For those of us who live at Alpine that means no more rolling out of bed and being at the mountain in a matter of minutes. Mountaineer won’t help if it means you will be sitting in the type of traffic backup usually found in Olympic Valley.
Do you have any insight as to what the gondola hours will be? I assume half the purpose is to get people to spend their apres ski $ in the squaw village and then come back to alpine. Maybe it runs base to base only before and after regular lift hours? It’s schedule will surely impact the number of extra cars packing the alpine lots…
I don’t think they know what the hours will be yet…there are many unanswered questions.
it can’t be operated after hours as per the use agreement. 4:30pm should be end of operations. It also can’t run beyond April 15th and before Nov 15th.
Aside from the environmental impact and other concerns mentioned, the parking situation at AM is a huge concern also. Powder day or not, ALL northbound Squaw traffic coming through Tahoe City is now going to detour straight up to AM and park at Alpine to avoid the rest of the traffic to Squaw *and* the nightmare parking situation at Squaw on weekends. It will be *so* much faster getting to Squaw to park at AM and take the gondola, it’s a total no brainer. Heck, Squaw-bound traffic from Truckee traffic might even start doing the same, because that turnout into Squaw gets backed up for miles from the Truckee direction on a busy day.
*Sigh* — for those of us who live along Alpine Meadows Road, the days of rolling out of bed and parking in 4 minutes will indeed be over…. Not only that, it’s just going to make parking at AM as nightmarish as it is at Squaw. AM will truly no longer be a “hidden gem.”
I don’t really see this making all that much of a difference for Alpine Meadows road. I mean, the parking lot has been filling up all the time before this anyway.
all the Alpine people think this gondola will be terrible. Yes, it opens up 4000 acres of terrain for the Alpine folks.
Yes, both Alpine and Squaw have a LOT of skiers on Saturdays. The gondoloa won’t change the total number… but might redistribute them (a bit). Please remember that it is the Saturday crowns that pay for the bulk of operating the mountains, and M-F crowds are way too small and not profitable on their won. The long term hope s that the Gondola will attract more midweek crowds and this will mean more long term housing needed at the base of either mountain. For those that don’t want new housing, and that there should be no crowds, and that KSL/ Alterra should replace Red Dog, Granite chief…. please remember that opening new terrain is a plus to most avid skiers (Gondola does this)… and Laterra originally wanted this Gondola to open terrain… but the permitting process deep-sized that (apparently). Who knows, 2+ years from now, Caldwell might open his terrain in some fashion, and it will eventually all work out well. Yes, 89 is crowded on Saturdays, and many of us don’t bother on Saturdays, as fighting that traffic is terrible.
If you don’t like the crowds, I don’t hear you asking Alterra to limit access (like… no Sumit chair rides unless you buy the full price ikon pass… like what Big Sky is doing next year for their tram).
In the meantime, we had a great year for just 300 inches of snow, and I give Ron Cohen et al 5 Starts fo managing both Alpine and Squaw this year… even if his “Indian War Woke-ism” is bizarre. When they tore down the Alex Cushing Statue at Squaw, many of us old timers were aghast…. but…. years later, it is back! Without alex, we’d still have a slow double chair for KT22, a slow double chair for Headwall, and no Granite Chief, and no Silverado, and no Solitude, etc.
As to the Squaw Village…. I can attest that KSL DID listen to a LOT of comments from us locals, and greatly revamped their planned future development… Lots of people enjoy the shops i the village, and until this year, enjoyed the MANY special days (wine festival, Earth Day, Wings and Brews, etc etc…. Please thank Ms. Ross for her leadership in bringing life and interesting events to Squaw and North Lake Tahoe during the summer time.
So, all you Alpine folks….. please give the Gondola a try… be positive…
I’ve skied every one of the days this season, including the busy weekends. I honestly don’t need any more terrain. There is plenty of terrain to keep me busy at Alpine every day, day after day. Yes, Ron has been great. SVAM has done a fantastic job given COVID and a low snow year. We say that several times a week here at UA. As to the village…some people like that stuff, some don’t. Thanks for toning down your comment and removing personal attacks.
You wrote one thing I agree with:
“If you don’t like the crowds, I don’t hear you asking Alterra to limit access (like… no Sumit chair rides unless you buy the full price ikon pass… like what Big Sky is doing next year for their tram).”
Let’s do it SVAM.
You said “Yes, both Alpine and Squaw have a LOT of skiers on Saturdays. The gondola won’t change the total number… but might redistribute them (a bit).”
And there-in lies the rub. People that want to just ski at Alpine are tired of Alpine serving as an overflow for Squaw Valley to “spread people out”.
I was wondering how many people won’t be on the mountains because they will be riding back and forth. If gondola is full, how many people will be on it who won’t be on the trails and other lifts?
please remove me from your blog
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The new gondola is a waste of time and money. Upgrading existing chairs would be much better. This is the worst plan I’ve seen in 40 years at SV.
Thanks for the great insights and ideas, Mark… I totally love reading all of the “Unofficial” articles… They are always entertaining and helpful… As a “Flatlander” and especially since I’ve missed most of 2 seasons because of that Pesky Virus, the joy of reading your blog is a fair substitute t actually being there. (I’m *finally* able to head up there next week, for a Birthday Week of skiing and fun with muh’ friends! Yay!)
I wish upon an Alpine Star that someone will change their minds and abort this abomination.
I will keep the pressure on for conservation.
As Nancy Reagan so aptly said, “ Just say NO! ( thank you)
I’ve been working in the ski industry for 45 years or so, 23 at AM, but I’m torn on how I feel about this project. I’m sadden by the thought of this pristine territory it will be crossing that will now have this tram as part of the view, but I understand as a business why they would want it.
I do believe that a better use of these funds would be to build more affordable workplace housing and perhaps replace one AM and one _V tired lifts.
The proverbial train barreling down the tracks and is upon us now is the large number of employees unable to find housing due to the new “work from home” crowd that have bought up most of the housing stock that once were long term rentals…… This new transport system will need many more Lift Operators and Maintenance personnel for day to day operations, where will they live? Seriously …..WHERE?
Mark- Very nice work describing the Gondola situation and the various considerations. Thanks. I was deeply involved in the legal effort to stop the project, for a host of reasons, many of which you have accurately described. We ultimately settled out of court with SVAM, finding that Granite Chief Wilderness, Five Lakes and at-risk species would be better served with settlement agreement protections than what we would end up with if we lost our appeals in court. (Placer County and its related appellate courts consistently rule with little regard for environmental protections). Ron Cohen and Bryan Elliott of Alterra really stepped up, in our negotiations, to address the conservation issues we saw at stake with the Gondola. They proved to be sincere. The settlement we reached includes: restricted access into Five Lakes from the KT station; no passenger on/off at White Wolf; no commercial development in the Lake Estelle Bowl (existing uses remain); and meaningful funding and conservation easements for species conservation efforts in selected areas. I personally remain deeply concerned about how the Gondola will impact AM, its impacts on Five Lakes Trail users, and the scale of the project. But I do believe the Gondola realignment and the SVAM agreement did lessen the environmental impacts of the project.
Word on the street is that a good amount of the funding for the gondola came directly from the COVID stimulus………